regarding our Refund Policy and the accusations going around on Twitter
morning I woke up with dozens of DM’s and Tweets regarding 1 of our members who
was accusing us of not following our own Refund Policy. That’s not the kind of messages you want to
see, when you try to run an honest business….
In this statement I will explain our policy, what I offered the member (he left
out that part) and my reasonings for handling like that. Furthermore I feel the
need to explain some screenshots shared from our group which give a wrong view
of how we operate and serve our members to give them the best possible view of
We indeed have a Refund Policy, we are one of the few groups around who strictly
follow the law, pay taxes etc etc. We also advertise with this Refund Policy as
we believe it’s a good sign towards interested students. And it works! In
September we had around 15 new members. 2 of them asked for a refund (various
reasons but not because we run a bad service) and they immediately got it.
As you can see here, we refund immediately, no matter what the reason is. We even refunded people who took a 4 months membership and wanted to cancel after 1 month because they needed the money (lost job).
What other paid service is offering that?
Imagine asking Netflix to cancel your 1-year membership after 3 months because you stopped watching. Chance for a refund = 0
shoes, wear them and ask after 10 days for a refund. You will get 0 where we
offered a partial refund but member left out that part.
one of our newer members contacted me, asking for a refund. He was already noticed
in the group as “special”. I will not go
into detail, but we all know those kind of people who enter a new group and try
to build a certain image by making bald statements and criticizing well known
and respected traders but at the same time asking me in DM some rookie questions
about Bitmex as he was close to a liquidation.
After 2-3 days in our group, he asked for a refund while I was doing a live
webinar. By the time the webinar was finished, the message was deleted.
He asked for a refund because he was liquidated on a trade which was against all our trading rules, he went full degen long BTC where we were expecting more downside and needed money to trade.
6 days later, member contacted me again asking for a refund (another liquidation?) and I started a conversation with him which was only partially shared on Twitter by him. In the days before, we noticed member had the typical “get rich quick” behaviour, very emotional and needed training. When he asked for refund I tried to convince him he should stay and instead of following a signal service, he should follow our Training Course and get rid off his trading behaviour what was just straight out gambling.
I even made him a special offer: stay the 1st month and when still not happy, we will refund the remaining 2 months. Again: what other paid service offers that?
time he agreed on that, thanked me for advise and I thought all was okay. I thought
I saved another trader from joining a signal service and understanding there’s more
needed to become a consistent profitable trader and I thought he realized he
needed to invest in himself instead of following others their signals.
Another 5 days later (next liquidation?) the member suddenly forgot about the offer I made him, doesn’t want to learn anymore and starts the tweet storm how bad our service is in his eyes.
As written above, I was honestly believing the member was happy with the special offer (refund after 1 month instead of 15 days) and I’m very surprised to see the sudden change of his behaviour.
The conversation he shared, I never refused the refund and let’s be honest: it would be pretty stupid to do that as the negative attention is very bad for our business, far more than the fees he paid us.
When I would follow our T.O.S. (which he explicitly agreed to when signing up) I would be in my right to not refund anything but that’s not how I want to operate.
But I think
this sudden change fits perfectly in the weird, emotional behaviour we saw from
him in the past days, totally neglecting the offer I made and trying to recover
by just gambling again instead of invest in himself. I can only imagine he made another poor trade
and someone must be blamed for that…He burnt his account and now unfairly
seeking attention to force a refund.
As written above, I offered him a refund and the offer still stands.
Now let’s take a look at the screenshots he shared from our Slack……
First you should know that we’re not a signal service and we don’t pretend to be 1. We openly advertise that we are (at first) a training group where members need to invest in themselves and willing to lean. As a bonus, we do trade together with the members but that’s not the focus in our group. All members are aware of this.
Member is falsely claiming we gave trading advise to short BTC. We have a very clear structure in our Slack and 2 channels for that:
1)MAJORS: view on the market. 3 team members sharing their ideas for BTC and some other big caps. This is where we post different possible scenarios which might change during the day and we update the posts. In my believe this is how people should use TA: prepare for different scenarios and act on that when 1 of the scenarios unfolds. In past days, I have shared multiple times my view, thinking BTC might go down more but I stated many, many times that people should be very careful shorting it because we were in the final stages of a big downtrend.
2) CRYPTOTRADES: channel where we post our trading ideas. All these trades are tracked in a trading journal with members and published weekly on our website. Full transparency, we’re not hiding anything and sharing our recap every week on twitter, also when we have a poor week. Decent, consistent profits where Risk:Reward is our most important parameter. It’s a suberb trading system for traders who understand trading Crypto is tricky but unforgiven when gambling like this member tried.
The messages he showed were from the first channel: where we post the “possible scenarios”. This is in no way a trade set up but I can imagine the type of trader like he is, he burnt his account and wants to recover asap by straight out gambling and using our “possible scenarios” as trading advice.
Not posting updates or doing a webinar: at that day, BTC was ranging for 2 days in a 2% range and market was very slow. While posting tonnes of updates every day from 7-8am to midnight, yes I recently started to follow the advice from older members: “take a step back once in a while, you work too much” and I decided to skip the Friday afternoon Live Webinar because of a slow market, we were updating our members constantly in the days before and we can not change the market so member can recover quickly.
Instead of that live stream, I made a 30mins video explaining my view of the market (but that’s not shared by him).
Not responding to his DM’s: as written before, we are a training group. Member contacted me several times with rookie questions. I asked him several times to post them in public channels.
Reason: when posting in public, other members can also react on it or can learn from it.
I don’t understand what is wrong about that, but it fits in the narrative that member wanted to look like an experienced trader for the other members.
It also clearly proofs that member was not willing to study any of our methods and just wanted some signals. His question also proofs that he wanted to trade where we advised not to, due to the market situation.
Summary: Crypto-TA MarketWatch group is running since October 2017. Since then I’m used to the fact that non members call me a scammer but during the 2 years that group became smaller and smaller. Not a single former member called us out for scamming or giving bad advice!
Until now, not a single negative review was posted on PaidGroupsReviews.com.
How ironic that I was the first in Crypto who came with the idea for such a review site.
Our group is explicitly for traders who need a training, a coach, guidance. Members with the “get rich quick scheme” usually don’t stay long as we do not offer what they are looking for. We endorse members to invest in themselves but these kind of traders just want some signals.
I’m very disappointed about this member turning our conversation and unfairly seeking attention with false statements and claims. In my understanding we agreed on a refund and he was satisfied with the outcome. The sudden change in his mind is weird, but could have been solved differently.
Yes, also by me…I could have given an immediate refund (which I usually do) and avoiding all the negative attention, but I was under the impression that he needed some good advice and training and he agreed with that.
The offer was made and still stands.